What you are seeing is an offical church training session on how to stage a demonstration. It was a long queue and they were shouting slogans. I had to post this here cos someone questioned my credibitlity in an orkut forum discussing “Church and Politics”.
Is that for real?!? Which Church is it?!? F*CKING HOLY CRAP, what has religion come to?
Comment by TheAnand — August 9, 2008 @ 11:47 pm
Goodness me!
So the idea of professional agitators is real.
Now I believe what I read years back.
Comment by Nikhil Narayanan — August 9, 2008 @ 11:47 pm
what difference does this have from islamic terror camps? just tht this is a smaller magnitude thing? Next we are going to see churches creating bombs and training sessions on how to kill and crap?
Vimochana samaram polum….who to free? free humans from life ?
Comment by T.hink.in — August 9, 2008 @ 11:50 pm
WTF … wht they are trying to do….these religious people are becoming real terrors…. in no time there will be christian terrorist groups…. r they teaching these stuff in sunday skools… ar in name of KCYL,KCYM,Mission League etc
Comment by Robins — August 9, 2008 @ 11:55 pm
What wrong in it, how it become Christian terrorism??
Is a rally is consider as terrorism?? If so what we should call our political parties???
Comment by Kochumon — August 10, 2008 @ 12:06 am
@ kochumon,
Well, a religious institution teaching people about rallying and agitating is called breeding hatred and which is basically terrorism.
Comment by TheAnand — August 10, 2008 @ 12:11 am
Politics is not Church’s game…. thats all…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 12:11 am
”Politics is not Church’s game” does that mean church is doing terrorism?? you are sick about church thats the problem
Comment by Kochumon — August 10, 2008 @ 12:14 am
For the past one year church and its leaders are attacked by politicians verbally, so they might be rallying against it. how can it be called terrorism??
Comment by Kochumon — August 10, 2008 @ 12:17 am
Well, WTF is small kids doing on that then? They are in fact being taught to hate, which is totally against the god is love concept of the church?
Comment by TheAnand — August 10, 2008 @ 12:19 am
”what difference does this have from islamic terror camps? just tht this is a smaller magnitude thing? Next we are going to see churches creating bombs and training sessions on how to kill and crap?”
@T.hink.in’s above comment
Why dont you bother about RSS shakha’s are conducting in and around temples in kerala?? Does that not terrorism according to your logic.??
Comment by Kochumon — August 10, 2008 @ 12:21 am
heard of a rally in changanassery ?
Thats called political terrorism. Rally was attended by UDF leaders… The church cant take sides buddy….
This is not a discussion about the RSS. So lets not bring that up here.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 12:24 am
Oh yes, every educated Hindu will tell you what kind of a MF’ing outfit the RSS and VHP is….fortunately they do not live in a world of self-denial.
Comment by T.hink.in — August 10, 2008 @ 12:25 am
”Well, WTF is small kids doing on that then? They are in fact being taught to hate, which is totally against the god is love concept of the church?”
@ Anand
God is love concept does not restrict christians to protest against the politicians who abuse its church leaders on streets. If christians not protesting then that will consider as their weakness. So there is nothing wrong in protesting in a peaceful manner like changanacheery rally.
Comment by Kochumon — August 10, 2008 @ 12:25 am
there is nothing wrong in protesting. Kerala is known for political murderers and the maximum criminals in the jail is from the current ruling political party. from which ankle do you think this is political terrorism. First take out your mask of terrorism, then speak against it.
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 1:33 am
The Anand
The rally was a peaceful one which was attacked by the communist terrorist. The frustration of the blogger for his political interest is very clear from this.
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 1:35 am
Well, WTF is small kids doing on that then? They are in fact being taught to hate, which is totally against the god is love concept of the church?
Anand
They are protest against thos who spread hatred. How about the poison spread by the student political wing and their vandalism? When a religion or religous institution is targeted, they have every right to protest as this is a democratic country. They held peaceful protest. It cannot be stopped using violence or by dictatorship as it happen in most of the communist countries.
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 1:43 am
A peaceful protest is not terrorism. Kenney, words matter. It is one thing when you ask church to refrain from involving in politics. But this is not terrorism. If you want to know what terrorism is, check out the Taliban and other Mujahhiddin camps in the Northwest Frontier province of Pakistan/Afghan border.
One easy way to differentiate would be the placards would be replaced by assault weapons.
However, what is shown in the picture is clearly not the case. The history of this country suggests that the whole foundation is laid on the citizen’s right for peaceful protest.
The Constitution of India provides the right for peaceful protests.
Article 19 of the Constitution says:
(1) All citizens shall have the right—
(a) to freedom of speech and expression;
(b) to assemble peaceably and without arms;
(c) to form associations or unions;
The first three sub clauses clearly defines it legal. Here, the people are expressing their views in the form of a protest.
So, do not compare this to terrorism. You can talk all about how Church should keep boundaries, but do not extend baseless allegations. I implore you to drop the word terrorism.
Comment by Issac — August 10, 2008 @ 1:52 am
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/3548/differencebetweenaprotepi7.jpg
Comment by Issac — August 10, 2008 @ 5:46 am
heard of a rally in changanassery ?
Thats called political terrorism. Rally was attended by UDF leaders… The church cant take sides buddy….
………………………..
Do you call all the rallies terrorism? Don’t you have the guts to start blogs against the rallies, hartal and political murders which has become like daily affair.
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 6:35 am
Don’t you have the guts to start blogs against the rallies, hartal and political murders which has become like daily affair.
You should definitely check out the archives. Politics is a lost case… I have lost all hope in them… And right now thats not our discussion.
If christians not protesting then that will consider as their weakness.
Christ also had was challenged.. when he was on the cross….. did he show his power ? Did we all think of it as his weakness. ? Church should not use its followers for a political power game.
from which ankle do you think this is political terrorism. First take out your mask of terrorism, then speak against it.
Xavier is always bend upon attacking me personally. Buddy I am a free man and I am not associated with any political party.
The topic of discussion is just not political terrorism. We are discussion the church using its grip on believers for political gains.
@Issac.
The picture is good.
But there is a small problem buddy. Those kids dont have any idea why they are shouting slogans. We are manipulating them and their faith in us.
BTW – Not all terrorists carry guns. Ever saw Narendra modi with a gun ?
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 7:11 am
I never thought Narendra Modi is a terrorist. He is a Chief Minister of a state of India.
At least you may justify calling him a terrorist by virtue of the allegations that he willfully aided in the massacre of muslims during the riots in Gujrat.
How would you connect these protests and terrorism?
How many people are massacred? How many innocent lives are gone?
(Do not site that Teacher who died, it had nothing to do with Church)
Comment by Issac — August 10, 2008 @ 7:56 am
Everyone can protest and demonstrate it… but using these kids and training them to do so is not fair…. it dosent matter whether its christians,hindus,muslims or any political groups… why r they utilizing these kids to do it…. they are trying to impose these things into the kids….
Comment by Robins — August 10, 2008 @ 8:03 am
and nowadays church and any other religious setup is acting like a business organisation… they sell belief of people and making profit out of it…
Comment by Robins — August 10, 2008 @ 8:15 am
Recall the history of christian church,it always needed power.It has always involved in politics.
The idea that Church must not be involved in politcs is rather new.
If you think deep you can see that all organised religions
had always a kind of “give and take” relationship with politicians.
So there is nothing wrong if church”trains” people for protest .Its embarassing that they are using children.but its nothing new.
Its not terrorism,you chose the wrong word.church did not create any “terror” by protesting using slogans.
Its not terrorism,i think we can call it fundementalism.
But how can we blame only church?
communist party of india(mafia) is more aggressive and irrational.For hem their party is their church.
What is the difference?
Comment by Dhanesh — August 10, 2008 @ 9:37 am
(Do not site that Teacher who died, it had nothing to do with Church)
I am not that stupid…..
communist party of india(mafia) is more aggressive and irrational.For hem their party is their church.
What is the difference?
This is not a discussion about the communist party and
I am not a communist. What they are doing is bad…. there is no doubt about it…
Its not terrorism,you chose the wrong word.
Ok… bad choice on that overly used word. Lets rephrase… Manipulation…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 10:09 am
kids are growing, manipulating their beliefs telling them that the whole govt. is against christainity will only breed hatred in those little minds. And hatred does not take much time to replace placards with guns.
And this is not terrorism, but its the starting phase of it. What happens when these peaceful protests go unheard? Kids go up in arms.
And I bet parents send in their children to all this not knowing what the church is moulding them into.
@xavier, if rapes keep happening every week, will you be living life normally taking it to be a “part of life?”
Dont be blind enough to see the evolution of terrorism in front of you. And have you ever thought why the temples were taken over by the govt. but not the churches?
Comment by TheAnand — August 10, 2008 @ 10:32 am
And have you ever thought why the temples were taken over by the govt. but not the churches?
Maybe because churches were run neatly so far…. am i correct ?
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 10:38 am
Stating a mere protest by church as a terrorism by a responsible blogger like you is a pathetic condition.Who said that church should not do any protest.i dont know where it is written…every citizen of india has the right to do protest..whether he is a priest or christian..mr kenney are you against the fundamental right of a citizen.. and about the childrens..if their parents have no any problems.. who is much bothered.. (for every ones knowledge..christian terrorism really exists in the world)
Comment by Joy — August 10, 2008 @ 12:01 pm
And this is not terrorism, but its the starting phase of it. What happens when these peaceful protests go unheard? Kids go up in arms.
so do you call every protest the first stage towards terrorism. Church has protest before too, where kids were also part in it and how many christian terrorist do you know in Kerala?
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 12:18 pm
@xavier, if rapes keep happening every week, will you be living life normally taking it to be a “part of life?”
I think you better ask this question to the government
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 12:19 pm
Just posting a picture and giving a heading like this proves the maturity level of the blogger
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 12:21 pm
i dont think there’s any problem in conducting peaceful protest rallies by churches…and i dont think the priests will force any one to join the rallies.I am also a christian and accordin to me the christian churches are havin enough democracy within itself.
I do have the right to speak against a priest if he is doin something wrong.
personally i am also against the protest by the churches against the 7th standard text.and i think the photo is a rally to protest against that.If such a rally is der in my church i will not join that….but churches conductin rallies is not terrorism.
Comment by Sujith — August 10, 2008 @ 12:26 pm
Xavier is always bend upon attacking me personally. Buddy I am a free man and I am not associated with any political party.
The topic of discussion is just not political terrorism. We are discussion the church using its grip on believers for political gains.
why should i attack you personally. I dont know you personally. I am only against your view towards certain things… only idealogical difference.. When some one post a pic with kids carrying play cards and saying there are christian terrorist, it is normal to reply to such stupid statements …or else you ban me from posting..
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 12:27 pm
Stating a mere protest by church as a terrorism by a responsible blogger like you is a pathetic condition
It was not a real protest. It was a training session for catechism students.
mr kenney are you against the fundamental right of a citizen
Protest as a citizen of India… not as a Christian and don’t use catechism students for that… its pure manipulation… what do those kids know about the situation ?
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 12:28 pm
everyone has the right to join a protest, that too a peaceful one. If you term these kind of protest as terrorism, all are terrorist including you and me….
Comment by xavier — August 10, 2008 @ 12:28 pm
Childrens are part of this society..I also worked with Mission league when i was a kid. During which we had rally against wars with boards. Now they are doing a rally against the policies of government. What is the wrong in that..Now the circumstances are changing..if church is not protesting..who will speak for them.They should protest for their rights in a peace full way..we are living not in A.D.1!
mr kenney..Are you saying that christians should never protest..even jesus protested against wrong acts of peoples.You can find the story in bible.
I think the word Terrorism used by you made all these mess atleast for me to comment over this post.you can have your own views. but it should not be like comparing church to terrorism publicly.
Comment by Joy — August 10, 2008 @ 2:02 pm
Thank God. I stopped going to church when I attained maturity.
Comment by vu2swx — August 10, 2008 @ 5:17 pm
I think the word Terrorism used by you made all these mess atleast for me to comment over this post.you can have your own views. but it should not be like comparing church to terrorism publicly.
Ok.. I agree that the word terrorism might be a bit premature. For the time being lets just say… “Manipulation”…
I dont think of this as a mess. This is a discussion and no church escapes it. I didn’t abuse anyone. I said what I felt… the church with this vimochana samaram part II is not going in the correct direction…
PS:- I am not a communist….
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 10, 2008 @ 5:39 pm
the actual training session or a real protest ?
Comment by dinu — August 11, 2008 @ 10:49 am
Hi Friends
i read all the comments wrote above.actually who can say the church is doing wrong?if they are doing wrong then all the political parties all the caste group are doing wrong,i think church have the privilage to contect there protest aganist they need,the law gaving them the privilage as a minority caste,is it?if there is no wrong in that then whats the problem.
Comment by Binu Mathew — August 11, 2008 @ 2:57 pm
I would actually go to the extent of saying that this is the starting of terrorism.
Religion is something very personal. Unfortunately Religion has been institutionalized and used for gaining money and power. Look at any religion for that matter.
Yes the church has always been involved in Politics and Power play – and from that point of view this is not very surprising (The crusades is a big example of this).
But now it looks like the church is going use its faithful followers as paws in its chess game. And guess what they are picking up the young one’s who dont even know what they are doing.
@All those who have been trying to support the church in the name of democracy, basic human rights and what not …I just want to ask you one question – how come the church is doing it now – how come the church did not organize any protest when a lot of other things went wrong? maybe they had an attack of conscience? right?
The basic idea behind the institution of religion is to give religious guidance to its followers. Now in what way is demonstration – religious guidance?
If you are telling me that – the church is trying to teach people their basic rights….etc? though I would appreciate the church for doing that – it still raises doubts in my head as to weather there is some hidden agenda behind this teaching…
Well some people here are asking how can we equate it to terrorism – well the madrisa’s also started by teaching innocent students Quran – now they have become training grounds for terrorist.
Any way – I have no Idea in what context these children were being thought to protest – So I reserve my final comments since I have no problem with any religion getting involved in politics for the earnest betterment of people – but please dont use the followers in a power game…
Comment by JMJ — August 11, 2008 @ 5:34 pm
Its a matter of prespective, What a terrorist is, A terrorist is a freedom fighter in his territory. But it creates a fight.The main outcome of war for peace is not peace its war. It is all conflicts, some say war, some say fight, protest, argument…, These are what happening here too.,
We need acceptance in spite of arguments without seeing the facts,
Negotiation in spite of making protest.
Peace in spite of making war.
Else its , every attempts to bring peace is just a waste of time.
Comment by Tony Jose — August 11, 2008 @ 10:23 pm
Bajrang Dal and VHP should be banned in India. If SIMI and NDF is banned in India, why Government is not putting a BAN on Bajrang DAL and VHP. Bajrang Dal is making the country into communal violance.
Comment by Prasanth — September 24, 2008 @ 3:53 am
@ Prasanth, You are Correct.
Thanks Kenny for this Topic. I like this Discussion,
I think after the Some Unfortunate Incidents in Manglore and Orrissa, The Opposites to Communists Change their Attitude.
Comment by Anish K.S — September 30, 2008 @ 10:30 am
Dear Kenney, Dont get frustrated with the adverse comments by many of the visitors.
It is evident, whether it is church or Politics, it is about selling ideologies and maximize their share of the power. Christianity in kerala could effectively use the poverty, and the ugly castiesm to make the institutions. Now it is an advanced stage of using the acquired power to push down other communities, so that further conversions can be made. Politics is also about selling their so called “ideology”. With the acquired power over the years, they would like to take on the church. It is a sad reality.
Comment by Satish Nair — June 13, 2009 @ 2:56 pm
The author of this blog seems to be a hard-core communist or has some problems as he considers a peaceful rally as an act of terrorism by just showing a supposed rally.. in the picture you can clearly see that there are no adults only the teenagers are there. It may be a rally by KCYM or can be procession to educate the ppl. So be a communist but don’t abuse your religious foundations!
Comment by Jude — June 13, 2009 @ 11:58 pm