Heard of Project Blank Noise ? If not visit this http://blog.blanknoise.org/
I was always afraid of girls and I still am cos I live in Kerala and I am a victim of “fear of being teased”. Our media, our elders and even our education system propagates this idea of “eve teasing” to an extent where girls tend to think of themselves are some sort of objects waiting to be teased.
Their definition of eve teasing includes
- Staring
- Looking
- Adjusting the rear view mirror
Ahhhhh I better appoint a female driver and wear opaque sunglasses. Read this script I wrote for a Sun Glasses Advertisement.
Every once in a while feminist magazines discuss eve teasing and ways to prevent it. I have discussed this with many of my friend including females and males. Majority of them had thought of this a a very common problem. But when discussed further they couldn’t quantify or come up with first person experiences. The ones who said they had experiences couldn’t say for sure whether it was intentional. May be I live in a very good society.
I am not saying that teasing is non existent. But I am sure this is not happening to an extent, these attention seeking feminist psychos think. I have never seen not even one instance of teasing in public. Do I live in a perfect society ? Right now in this room there are 4 males and none except one has first hand experience of a teasing incident. The one that has says he saw a couple in a park and the male was teasing….. wait… teasing ???? or were they enjoying ?
See Blank Noise protest Photos here. Burhhhhhgggaaaaa I feel like vomiting.
Some Do’s and Dont’s for men to be safe from feminist psychos.
- Never even go near a girl in public
- Always stand in between males in a queue
- Avoid public transport
- Dont let any girl sit near you in a public transport
- If you are going alone to the movies, buy tickets for adjacent seats also.
- In public, wear opaque sunglasses.
- If you see a girl driving, make sure you are at least 100mts far
- Never visit malls when they are crowded
- Do not use your camera mobile where there are females, even if its for calling.
Finally take revenge when you are married for depriving you of your normal social life 
rightly said sir..
very few people have seen such incidents. i have seen eve teasing and sexual advances @ public places are seen only in movies.
girls. wat are they?? something of immense value?????
naaaaaaaaaaa….
they are the ones asking for equality of gender and by mistake if we brush them it becomes harrasment. wat do they expect? shud we jump over them to avoid contact when we are in a crowded place???
i too agree that eve teasing takes place and so does molestation. but i don’t think it is a magnified as these ‘feminists’ express.
wat do they expect??? an eve teaser around every corner of the street????
girls are the ones who do the provocation. if they want not to b stared at, they should try not to wear mini skirts, not to go to parlor for beauty checks and wear a veil. or rather they’d stay home
Comment by Varun Anand — August 3, 2008 @ 7:56 pm
Feminists are a group of ladies who are useless in all respects. They don’t know what they are doing. Such movements are there for a long time. Did they bring some appreciable change in the lives of people who are living in rural areas and low level people living in urban areas? No.
In fact girls and aunties are teasing men with half naked dressing. For live examples, look around yourself.
Comment by Derick — August 3, 2008 @ 9:11 pm
Varun just said the main point here, they are the one’s who are actually virtually inviting others to look at them.
Well again, if we tell them to wear proper dress,they would argue that we are old fashioned.
Comment by Niranjan — August 3, 2008 @ 9:54 pm
How to dress is part of personal freedom. I wouldnt agree that teasing happens because of dressing. But dressing definitely brings attention. Is someone walks around in a mini skirt and we dont notice… then its time to see a doc.
The point here is that “Blank Noise” is glorified bullshit. They are blowing the issue out of proportion.
I wonder whether they have learned the rule of attraction or not.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 3, 2008 @ 11:24 pm
http://blog.blanknoise.org/2005/07/he-placed-his-hand-on-my-breast-and.html
This is indeed a good little thoughtful blogger who unfortunately picked the goddamn wrong topic!
The site itself seems to be rarely visited and the author has a good piece of imagination and a kick for fantasies.
And we men, when are we going to be organized against flirting women who break our hearts and wallets. Hmm, hows filledsilence for a name!
Comment by TheAnand — August 4, 2008 @ 12:15 am
You know, I’ve always thought its best to empower women to take care of themselves. Teaching girl children some effective self-defense version of martial arts does wonders for their confidence. A lot of such ‘imagined’ eve teasing would just disappear naturally. As for the rest of real physically evident teasing, the woman can now take care of herself.
I’ve known about Blank Noise for a long time now; used to be an interesting place. Now, its an echo chamber. I”m sure there are still some really smart people working to change things. (I confess, I haven’t kept up with them for 2 years)
and Of course, I do agree that Indian streets have become a very harsh place to live in for Gentlemen.
I mean, every man has the god given right to turn his head when a stunning ‘head-turner’ passes by. I find there’s nothing disgusting about this. Its instinctive human behaviour and in no way constitutes harassment. Its just not fair that God gave women a 150 degree angle of vision(for watching over her brood) and men got a <90 degree angle (tunnel vision optimised for hunting and fighting). Men are naturally disadvantaged if they decide to admire a pretty woman.
[lol, Now you know how women never get caught ogling. :p]
@Kenney: Switching to Opaque glasses means, we’re over-reacting to the pressure exerted by the firebrand feminists. Even guys have to stand up for themselves sometime.
This is a multi-faceted issue that cannot be adequately judged in a single post+comments. Kenney, lets hear more such tales of how social forces are affecting real Indians.
DISCLAIMER: This is just a ‘comment’. When i write a blog post, i’ll be sure to give a dispassionate objective POV to all sides of an issue. I respect women and think they’re the pillars of our families and society. Please don’t lynch me if you see me in queue to watch a movie in EKM. :p
I’m not even going to bother watching my back.
Comment by Vimal George — August 4, 2008 @ 12:42 am
@Kenney: that sun glasses script needs a registration process to view it. Too much hassle. Could you just link to a non-expiring pastebin http://pastebin.com/
Comment by Vimal George — August 4, 2008 @ 12:53 am
hey! i feel like must u hav never come out of car or u may not hav travelled in a very tighty packed bus.
i travell in 2nd said condition. and can u believe it, there is no day in the bus in which i haven’t seen above discussed phenomenon!
there are many cool eve teasers who don’t get into the bus when it is been stopped infront of them and suddenly when the bus start they run and get in to the ladies door and rest u know!
and one day l asked one of them why they don’t get into the bus when it is being stopped and rush later ?
one among them (who i felt is more decent ) said” if we would enter the bus when it is being stopped we would haven’t any choice either to get into the bus in through men’s door”
nxt one continued “and we won’t be allowed to reach girls as there are many big PLAYERS inside it and getting in through ladies door ensures no problem and complete satisfication”
but i do agree with u in context that it is been overdramatised now a days
and ur do’s and dont’s is what a male should read to confirm his good health
and don’t u want to know what happened to this eve teasers?
one day frm nr by school a girl and her father got into the bus in males and ladies door respectively
and our hero’s started doing the same thing with her . her father saw it and gave one mighty slap to one who did it. And the one’s who were watching this for months said that he was no t alone and ponted others and rest the crowd did
after that incidence i havn’t seen any hero’s and no again phenomenon’s
Comment by sreehari — August 4, 2008 @ 10:07 am
I have traveled a lot in buses buddy. In fact 18 years and I never saw one incident of eve teasing. Ive have traveled in crowded buses jam packed between females. Its the most uncomfortable experience you can ever have, cos you are always conscious and afraid of this teasing phenomena.
My point is…. this teasing thing is overrated…. we males are not so bad…..
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 4, 2008 @ 10:15 am
but i usually see it here!
Comment by sreehari — August 4, 2008 @ 10:28 am
ur problem with net connection over?
delete this one as soon as u read it!
Comment by sreehari — August 4, 2008 @ 10:30 am
u r right ?
this teasing thing is overrated…. we males are not so bad…..
Comment by sreehari — August 4, 2008 @ 10:38 am
just 1 more thing
they say clicking fotos without permission is eve teasing. i wud like to know about the fotos on their blog of men who they accuse of eve teasing, have they got it with permission from the male or is it ADAM-TEASING???
Comment by Varun Anand — August 4, 2008 @ 1:49 pm
“While the efforts of this project are commendable, the inevitable question arises. Are you really looking to create a long term workable solution for women so that they may stop suffering while feeling confident about themselves? Or are you just looking to gather the trapped emotions within suffering women in this country and make them support your cause so that you can get a good academic grade for your project at college?
In other words, do you have a political agenda? How do you plan to support individuals who have taken part in your movement from those who despise this?
- Li Mei, Taiwan”
From: http://blog.blanknoise.org/2005/07/he-placed-his-hand-on-my-breast-and.html
I just read the above blog and that one comment caught my attention.
Whilst intending no disrespect to the female gender, I feel that this thing about eve teasing is way over board…and that is because – it has got to do more with the mind and less with the body.
“You know, I’ve always thought its best to empower women to take care of themselves. Teaching girl children some effective self-defense version of martial arts does wonders for their confidence. A lot of such ‘imagined’ eve teasing would just disappear naturally. As for the rest of real physically evident teasing, the woman can now take care of herself.” – Vimal George
I have seen both the cases where there has been attempts to tease a woman and cases where the women have tried to take advantage of the eve-teasing laws…
The approach of Indian society/government towards equality in the social system is a big reason for this misgiving. The politicians have made it vote-bank politics for their own personal gains.
Look at what happen to reservations for the Dhalit’s….even after 60 years of independence what good has come to them.
Same with Women…we created separate doors, seats, Compartments, Colleges for them…And I don’t think it will ever solve the problem.
In the previous posts also – where we discussed co-education, I stressed the point about Children learning to live with the opposite sex and learning to respect them is very important. I think our society needs to focus more on that than create more blank – noise about Eve teasing or Adam teasing.
There is nothing that a woman can do that a man cannot – and there is nothing that a man can that a woman cannot. Man and Woman are equal in all sense. But nature has created both man and woman to fulfill different roles in society. Let us try and focus on fulfill those roles rather than trying to replace or complain about each other…
Comment by JMJ — August 4, 2008 @ 11:52 pm
In no way justifying eve-teasing or harassment of women – On the other extreme – I would equally blame the female gender for what they have bought upon themselves.
There was a time when women could not go out of the house with out a male companion, or some of the of the religions even advocated covering up the whole body including the face when going out – and forget women coming out during night.
Our forefathers foresaw this problem and created all these rules to protect the female gender. By the 20th century things changed – women began to revolt saying that men were oppressing them and controlling them. And finally when they get out of the so-called oppression – they start complaining that they are being teased and harassed.
Now dont tell us that we did not tell you what was coming….
One more way of looking at it is – the male species has been on top for generations and generations – now suddenly the female species shows up and wants to overthrow the male species from the throne, they have been sitting in for generations and generations…..
Now you expect the male species to go out without a fight???Well when you decided that you are going to play the game – you must be ready to get dirty as well…
Comment by JMJ — August 5, 2008 @ 12:17 am
One more thing that I have not really understood is the Female empowerment thing….Look at what we have achieved.
1. The most his Serials/Soaps in India are the ones in which one female oppresses/harasses the another female – and guess who is the biggest audience – females
2. Females can successfully walk in whatever cloths they want – fully clothed, half naked or sometimes – some places without cloths
3. Prostitution has become legal in some countries…
4. Worlds biggest industry – Female fashion and Cosmetics
Well men just got what they wanted – wife’s, mothers and sisters sitting at home glued on to serials – more business selling cosmetics, sexy half naked women at every corner, and plenty of women to sleep with…
Comment by JMJ — August 5, 2008 @ 12:29 am
I have not see one comment from the Female gender. I would love to see the female prescriptive of this topic….so any female reading this topic – please leave your comment – remember we are the good guys…
Comment by JMJ — August 5, 2008 @ 12:33 am
Hello Mr. Kenney Jacob. I see that you have no regard for women folk whatsoever. This post is aimed at crippling a movement that has had great success across the country and we are not going to be cowed down by criticisms from people like you.
But you should have the broad mindedness of accepting the fact that these incidents do happen all over the metros and I recommend reading the papers once in a while to see if there is a single edition of a daily which goes without reporting a rape or a molestation. No one is safe, small girls to married ladies.
Comment by Jasmine — August 5, 2008 @ 12:47 am
Oh God…2 things i cant stand in this world are liars and feminists. God bless and save them and open their eyes as to what they are doing.
Once I had a serious tiff in the classroom with a (well known) feminist teacher who urged the girls in our class to make the groom undergo an ELISA test to be sure that he isn’t HIV+ve! Oh how she left us boys pissed off…we almost made her cry and leave her bloody lecture in the middle. She never returned to our class or spoke to me ever in college…shows her maturity.
And thanks for the flikr pics of those ‘gorgeous models’..anyone would ‘tease’ them at first looks
But at the same time Kenny, our Kerala is a touch too arrogant when it comes to behaving with the fairer sex. Cant close my eyes to that…
Comment by scorpiogenius — August 5, 2008 @ 3:07 am
@ scorpiogenius: mmm… exactly what are you trying to imply… that a bride-to-be doesn’t have the right to ask for mutual testing?
Are you being sexist or pleading the cause of some higher human right that I haven’t heard about?
and. . would you please stop sounding so smug about making women cry. Its not the incredible achievement your language makes it out to be. Your comments on HER maturity are even more amusing. Thats a really mature POV. *hiccup*
Comment by Vimal George — August 5, 2008 @ 3:12 am
How vulgur is the description of so-called “eve-teasing” given at their ‘official’ site:
“”How have you felt every time you ignored a stranger’s eyes stripping you naked?”"
Why the hell, do they have to imagine-up things which are not intended??
And their Flickr photostream contains, women holding a poster, posing for the photo and the caption of the photo is: “Why are you looking at me ?”
If it’s not for us to see, shut your damn camera somewhere and leave, plz.
Comment by Aravind Jose T. — August 5, 2008 @ 6:37 am
@Jasmine
I did accept the fact that it happens. But I am sure you are blowing the issue out of proportions and creating a mess out of it. I grew up in this concept of teasing, reading news reports everyday, hearing discussion about this “hot” topic and kind of afraid of the whole funda.
But I have never seen an offensive action once in my 25 years of life. Project blank noise is arrogant and indecent. Look at one of their logos… a female hand with a high heeled shoe…..
You are trying to make even the most innocent actions into an eve teasing act. You are psychos….. and you think about this only….. expecting an eve teaser at every corner……
We are not rapists, teasers and molesters. We are fathers, sons, brothers and husbands. When you walk through the streets next time… try to look for a father, son, brother or husband…. I am sure… you will find “Filled silence”…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 5, 2008 @ 6:47 am
And that’s it Kenney.
That’s it.
The comment above says all what need to be said.
[don't think that I'm in support of "ev-teasing" or anything. But, that movement, quite simply is totally absurd.]
We agree that there might be some male psychos just like the female counterparts behind (BlankNoise) who commits indecent deeds.
For that, you need not accuse all the males.
As kenney rightly said:
“When you walk through the streets next time… try to look for a father, son, brother or husband…. I am sure… you will find “Filled silence”…
Comment by Aravind Jose T. — August 5, 2008 @ 6:52 am
Most guys who have commented have bin thrashed publicly by ladies for indecent behavior or belong to boys hostel who have no idea about women. but the best thing in an instant this can all change …just tease their sisters, wives or girlfriends(if they have any ie) First know the meaning of Feminists then use it as an abuse or juz say you dont have the b***s to accept reality…never witnessed eve teasing …what crap!
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 12:22 pm
@Deepak
You have become quite emotional, but you have not added any point to this discussion. You better go back to the posts and comments and then come up with something constructive.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 5, 2008 @ 12:35 pm
haha you’re the ones to talk about adding valid points. I’ve read the posts and this is what I get from it.
They, who have commented
(1) Taporis from a boys hostel
(2) Rejected losers who’re trying to redeem their lost pride by saying whose interested in girls
(3) Insecure guys who think girls will soon ‘overthrow’ them from their ‘thrown’
(4) Men who cant keep it in their pants when they see a girl be it in a salwar or a skit. Chhedne ka bahana chahiye salon ko.
I think blank noise is a great initiative. Unfor it fails to make losers such as you understand what its all about
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 12:54 pm
. “Is someone walks around in a mini skirt and we dont notice… then its time to see a doc.”
Diff between taking notice and shamelessly staring with jaws dropped. Have u ever wondered about what the girl must be going thru when pervs such as you do that. Doesn’t matter father, brother, husbands. They’ll all do it except when it comes to their families
“Ive have traveled in crowded buses jam packed between females. Its the most uncomfortable experience you can ever have, cos you are always conscious and afraid of this teasing phenomena.”
Ur guilty coz u know ur quite capable of doing it. Men who don’t have any such intention never think the way u do. Have a lotta growing up to do…
My point is…. this teasing thing is overrated…. we males are not so bad…..
Speak for yourself and only yourself
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 1:04 pm
Deepak, I am sure you are blind to the point here. Can you tell me how many of your personal friends have been harassed in public? I hate to say this, it includes your family members as well.
I am sure that these incidents do happen, but not in the magnitude blanknoise is making it look like. As if every third guy in the street is a rapist!!!
And are you trying to suggest that we shud speak only for ourself and not for anyone else? Well, what is blanknoise trying to do then?
Comment by TheAnand — August 5, 2008 @ 1:18 pm
@Deepak
On what basis have you come up with an analysis of the commentators ?
The list is interesting but still its just an insecure and emotional mind typing fast on the keyboard.
And you are quite true in saying that I am capable of teasing. Then I am capable of doing 100 other things and I dont intend to do all of them.
And I have spoken my experience only. I have never seen this teasing phenomena to the extent this blank noise is claiming to be happening. Some of the commentators also agree on that.
Fortunately for me buddy, I live in a good world.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 5, 2008 @ 1:27 pm
Most of my friends complain till date and unfor they have accepted it as ‘part of life’ dont u find it unusual constantly being ogled, stared at by men. My ex was groped by one such pervert at 5 in the morning while on her way to the temple so what shd i tell her not to go to temples. Dont go by media reports. More than half of the cases go unreported.
Not a rapist but def not a gentleman is he. Juz yest I followed 4 youngsters who were harassing a lady trying to cross the street. Now the normal thing would be not to follow them and carry on with what they were doing but I dont walk blindfolded or pretend to be blind when i see such acts happening.
Ne1 can sit on their asses and comment. Reality however is very different and yes i have learnt to act with courage. Dont 4get New years both 2007 and 2008 where 100s were molesting 2 helpless girls. Are you saying these deprived and desperate souls will give up an opportunity like this. True courage is not questioning what blanknoise is doing its joining them in their efforts to make it safe for each and every woman out there and I salute them for it. Oh ya theres a diff between Feminists and misandrists do not confuse the two.
If u notice blanknoise has only invited ppl to share their experiences which many women have come forward and shared which is impoosible for them to do otherwise. Do u know how emb it is to talk about sexual harassment ???
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 1:35 pm
Kenney Jacob as i said u have a lotta growing up to do. I hope for the women in your life its sooner rather than later. Have a nice one
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 1:37 pm
Deepak, there you go…india, the land of billion population gets 100s of cases reported.
Comment by TheAnand — August 5, 2008 @ 1:40 pm
growing up, tht you have to. why are the girls mum? that is not the problem here. but accusing every youth of being a molester is sheer stupidity!!!
as if saying every muslim/hindu in the country is a terrorist just bcuz a few are….
Comment by TheAnand — August 5, 2008 @ 1:42 pm
Examples are fine. I can also get you examples of teasing. But I can also get you examples of rapes and even murders.
A few examples don’t prove anything. There are gays and lesbians in the street. There are drug addicts and alcoholics. But wouldn’t it be stupid to assume that you will find one around every corner.
The most hilarious are the captions for the photos. .. “Why are you looking at me”…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 5, 2008 @ 1:58 pm
every youth? if tht was d case i wdnt b there as a guy…y are the girls mum? its society!
u guys arent even willing to accept that eve teasing exists y in the world a girl wd waste her time explaining what happ…lemme guess u’d say “I dont think it exists” even when ur own sister complains to u of it. As i said easy to deny coz thats the easier way. Sum1 asked me have i gone thru all the posts. Have u gone thru the entire website to know what BN is all about or are ur juvenile theories based on one blog.
A woman cant even feel comfortable to go the police with her complaints coz they never act, her parents ask her to keep mum abt the whole issue, her boyfrnds blame her for the incident, few extremist women’s groups will take her story to hog media limelight where does she go.
The recent Aarushi murder case should be an eye opener even a dead girl is not spared , her character being attacked after shes gone. how pathetic!!!
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 1:59 pm
YEs i think thats a question all girls have when pervs stare and stare and stare
shes not some alien walking the streets or something thats showcased in a window of a shop…shes a human being the earlier ppl real that the better
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 2:04 pm
Here are some facts.
Most Indian men don’t have the luxury of going to co-eds like you and me did. Their only contact with a woman are dirty magazines, print media, porn movies. When they see those porn stars exaggerating moans and screams (of pleasure of course) they think all women love it and they wouldn’t really mind when men touch them in public places. They think they’re doing a big favor on the woman coz that excites her. Most of these romeos are inspired by Hindi films as well where the women first plays hard to get then when the hero forcefully kisses her she falls in love with him (watch david dhawan movies for your facts…do u need links as well?)
“uski naa mein hi haan hai”
she means a yes when she says no …geez I thought no always meant no!
Well now what does the Indian male whose just reached puberty do in that case. He’ll fantasize, go to public parks where other couples make out, stand outside girls colleges and if hes really lucky theres a whole bunch of them who think just like him ie prey on what you see touch, feel , molest…its all fair who knows when will he get a chance next right?
Or maybe they feel the only time they can have their ‘fun’ is after marriage. Now considering the legal age in our country is 21…do u expect these beasts to wait for a decade (considering we achieve puberty at 12) …na ahhh!
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 2:09 pm
Hey Deepak – Now you are talking….
You yourself have put up a classic case of what is actually happening…the incident – the keep it quite – the media making elephant out of the ant….and so on…
But dont you think blaming the boy is a little un-fair: keeping in mind that from all his infinite sources his knowledge is limited to the porn movie he has seen.
The India society does not allow girls and boys to study together – leave alone talking about sex…so for most of the people the source of knowledge about sex and romance is magazines, porn, movies….Unfortunately things are a little too exaggerated, like you have said.
Instead of working towards changing the fundamental problem of opening up the society and educating the sexes to respect each other.
I work in a foreign country where I see all kinds of people – Black, white, brown – the Chinese, Indian’s, Pakistani’s, Brits, Zulus, Boers… I have not seen or heard about Eve teasing over here (I am not saying that there are no rapes and murders). This is a society that does not divide between Women and Men. Men and women are free to sleep with each other….
All this Blank Noise & Filled Silence is of no use. Unless we work towards changing these fundamentals in our society and E-Ducate (I stress Education – not literacy. Any one can learn how to read and write their name – but what we want is for people to take informed decisions) the people – Every girl will see a rapist in every man and every man will see a whore is every woman he sees…unfortunately.
Let us try and discuss the underling problem then work towards solving it – The blank noise project is aimed at solving the overlying problem of eve-teasing – and can only be solved by putting every man into jail….
This is one common trend I have seen with a lot of these groups – like the nature groups – they want to stop all types of pollutions – but they don’t seem to think – they themselves are using up so much resources that need to pollute. There is no way you can stop pollution unless we go back to stone age….(May be that will solve the eve-teasing problem also….)
Comment by JMJ — August 5, 2008 @ 3:02 pm
@ Vimal…
My point was that why only men must undergo ELISA to prove themselves??? Why HIV cant spread through women? That miss was hell-bound on making the male sex appear immoral and sex-addict
And re maturity, she was a ‘teacher’..so engaged in a cold war with a student cant be exactly described as a mature behaviour, can it?
Comment by scorpiogenius — August 5, 2008 @ 3:21 pm
Eve-teasing is a reality. No doubt about that. I have seen it in every crowded place – buses, cinema halls, exhibition places – wherever people gather in crowds. I do not deny the fact that it is an evil to fight.
However, Blank Noise is not the answer. It is just an urban showcase project, nothing else. Their noise is getting so blank and dangerously so, because it is turning out to be an ‘anti-men movement’. I had written about Jasmine and her project back in 2006 – Of noise, blank and blank noise.
Comment by Jo — August 5, 2008 @ 4:53 pm
JMJ –
are u saying watching movies and removing ur frustration on innocent girls is fine? No1s blaming ALL MEN. You and me are indian society and yes we need to take the blame or resp for whatever is happening and I think BN is doing exactly that. If your that enlightened y dont u come up with concrete measures so that women can step out even at 2 in the night without being harassed. Are you saying eve teasing doesnt happen during festivals, in public transport. You not from India are you? Ask any woman and she’ll say its an everyday phenomena. Now you got BN talks about respecting women not hating all men as you guys have narrowed it down to which is a shame. I’ve bin abroad and yes women arent teased if shes wearing a skirt or a sleveless T like u have in our repressed indian society.
Frankly we’re 20 years behind most cultures only ahead of places like the Middle East where a woman is punished for being raped. Can send you links to prove my argument.
Interesting you bring up that topic just last week I had an argument coz my friend declared that this girl who was standing below our bldg at 9.30 is a whore when i asked him how did he know …he said isnt that really obvio look what shes wearing she’ll sleep with anyone…WOW
These are rules men have made and we’ve bin following this whole load of crap since ages.
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 6:13 pm
I was just going through the Black noise website and couldn’t control my laughter on this item-”ADJUSTING REAR VIEW MIRROR” is eve teasing. Well traffic dept is to be blamed.
traffic rules says that you need to adjust rear view mirrors before starting the vehicle.
The site is simply to show frustrations of some kind…only the author knows, to males.
Comment by Nirmal — August 5, 2008 @ 7:11 pm
There are many perverts among us.We have seen that on mumbai and kerala incidents on the new year day……….But it is not right to brand all the men the same way……………….in our society the two genders does not mingle each other naturally….for example the passanger seat structures of the busses…….that is the reason why some people gets a insecurity when they travel with women (i think this is only in kerala)……Perverts are there in every society….
Comment by Maneesh J — August 5, 2008 @ 8:18 pm
@deepak:”…had an argument coz my friend declared that this girl who was standing below our bldg at 9.30 is a whore when i asked him how did he know …he said isnt that really obvio look what shes wearing she’ll sleep with anyone…WOW”
This is another thing that bothers me. When i first came to my college in Kerala, lots of otherwise popular guys had this inbred attitude towards women. I found it hilarious at first, but then, long association with my peers slowly pushed me along to the point where I started making these disgusting assumptions as well.
It took me a while to realize what a creep I had become. It took a lot of pain and antagonizing several of my peers to finally break out of the mentality. I’m living proof that this sort of mentality is infectious among guys. I swear to all thats good and holy that I’ll try my best to instill incorruptible values in any sons i may have. I know it sounds like a long shot, but its the only real solution we have.
Women have a huge responsibilty in this regard. Educated women should take particular care to instill the right attitudes towards both the sexes in their children. Somehow, i don’t have a lot of faith in most of the current male generation. The double-standards in their minds still continue to show up despite their best efforts to hide it away.
I dont claim to be a saint, I am corrupted as well. I am proof enough.
Comment by Vimal George — August 5, 2008 @ 9:35 pm
Nirmal no1 cares a shit abt ur ticklish sensation…
Adjusting rear view is basically for auto and taxi wallahs who do it all the time. have you sat with ur gfrd they wanna knw every lil details of whats happening in the back. Why the hell do we need mirrors inside the rick newaz they have 2 on the sides and the back is covered.
Vimal …hats off for being so honest. You’re doing well
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 10:47 pm
@ Deepak
Who is talking about takin your frustration out on innocent girls??? I was only saying that you cannot really blame the whole male species just because one pervert somewhere harassed an innocent girl….
I was only trying to explain to you that this is a natural phenomenon – keeping in mind our cultural background – where women were a few rungs lower to men. It is the natural instinct of any species to challenge anything that threatens its territory (The throne example…)
10-20 years ago – would your mother or sister or wife – go out of the house wearing tight tops and mini skirts? I don’t think so! But today it is a reality. But unfortunately our society (especially – the men) is not ready for such a big change. This eve teasing is a phenomenon that will be there for some time and then finally fade away.
This is where I stressed the need for a constructive approach where you try and educate the society. Keeping watch at places you think is a hot spot for perverts – or posting your experience on the web and blaming all the men for it, and making noise about it is not the solution.
Doing all this only makes the good people left out there think they are now being victimized and hence revolt to the whole idea. Think about it – just because you got teased at a spot – you make up your mind that every other man going that way is a pervert – is that not a little extreme?
This is why Projects like Blank Noise is being compared to the Indian politics – they will make noise for anything and everything – just to get some attention.
My heart goes out all those ladies who were harassed. But what you need to do is to try and change it from the root – cause making a hue and cry about things usually repels people away.
@ Maneesh
“……Perverts are there in every society….”
Very Very True…
@ Vimal
“I swear to all thats good and holy that I’ll try my best to instill incorruptible values in any sons i may have. I know it sounds like a long shot, but its the only real solution we have.”
That is the way to go…
@ Deepak
“Adjusting rear view is basically for auto and taxi wallahs….”
This is a big revelation. I have been wondering what this adjusting rear view mirror harassment is all about.
This is where I say that People like Blank Noise are failing – by generalizing everything.
Comment by JMJ — August 5, 2008 @ 11:23 pm
This is one of my recent posts. And you argue it doesnt happen everyday. Didnt have news channels around to show it you unfor.
I reached my bldg gate and heard a voice singing. When I looked behind there were 4 Bihari youths and in front was a woman in a pink kurta. I couldnt understand since I dont know the language but I got doubtful when I heard ‘gulabo’. They seemed to be having a gala time, with hands on each others shoulders, fidgeting, trying to trip each other. I followed them till the woman crossed the road but while I was doing that I so badly wanted to slap one of them. A cop was stationed very close but I never expect them to move an inch. Those few steps were not easy, I must have had a million thoughts going thru my head. I dunno what to feel right now. To be honest Im still 99% sure and not 100 that it was sexual harassment that I was witnessing. When I see or hear such things I usually vent it out by abusing alone but i honestly dunno if that would help today. I felt like a ‘fool’ when i was following them. No one seemed to bother them except me…a thought crossed my mind that i should go home but I dunno what i was waiting for, an educated fellow following these rats. The woman looked disturbed as most women would be if you have men following you…she kept looking back … honestly i was arguing she looked a lil worried coz she was trying to cross d street. They came very close to her while passing her and I think I was waiting for that so that I could pounce and beat the shit out of them…I dunno but not feeling too good abt the whole thing. The anger which i have against such people is indescribable but the worst thing is its only bothering me…thanks
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 11:28 pm
“This is where I say that People like Blank Noise are failing – by generalizing everything.”
I have asked a few of em and they have admitted its no use except to check women out. If it was such a compulsion howcome most of them dont and a few do??? I never said ALL MEN are perverts. Why do you forget Im one but I’m a human being 1st, speaking up for whats wrong is my right. Gender has nothing to do here. A lot of men too suffer be it false rape or false dowry charges. I personally will speak up for them as well.
“……Perverts are there in every society….”
Thats true…
Comment by Deepak — August 5, 2008 @ 11:35 pm
@Deepak,
Who the hell said that adjusting rear view mirrors is only for Autos and taxis? I was mentioning about the eve teasing methods written on that on crap site.
I never seen auto drivers adjust their rear view mirrors when there is a girl behind, grow up man, dont look into everything with suspicious eyes and blame others.
Comment by Nirmal — August 6, 2008 @ 9:07 am
A MALE friend refered me to this post saying, “you should probably check out, a lot of MCP comments up their.”
He was right, but I don’t have the time or patience to join this mad debate, one has to become a pig to fight a pig and I have no such intentions….
Just one question for you kenny…what did you mean by “Finally take revenge when you are married for depriving you of your normal social life?”
I am really intrigued by all the possible interpretation of that statement, I can write a whole blog post on it actually..and may be I will later, but before that wud you care to explain what exactly did you mean?
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 11:16 am
@Nirmal
Yeah right, uve sat with each and every girl in the back seat to know. Besides no1 really cares about your moronic beliefs. I go by what is…u still havent replied y they do have it in the 1st place especially when the rear is covered. Next time do a survey with the women of your house and then talk about eve teasing. We need real people to discuss real issues not boys college drop outs…
Comment by Deepak — August 6, 2008 @ 11:46 am
@Sanjukta
Did you see an emoticon next to the statement ? I hope you noticed a change of tone in the last section of the post.
If you are still clueless it was supposed to be a joke… may be I am bad at telling jokes.
And… its amazing to see how easily you girls use the word MCP…. wonderful…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 6, 2008 @ 11:52 am
“If we had no sexual harassment we would have no children.”
Yup you guys heard it right.
Check this out :
http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/node/9406
Just another link to prove how insanely biased society is … be it Moscow or Mumbai
Comment by Mohnish aka Deepak — August 6, 2008 @ 12:07 pm
@Kenny, I noticed the emoticon. That doesn’t explain anything. I am still curious what exactly you even joked about. And about things you don’t notice…you didn’t notice I quoted a MALE friend of mine who used the word MCP?? I don’t want to take his name but he is been actively participating in this debate right here.
It is a natural assumption on your part that only woman would use the word MCP isn’t it?
To the friend who referred me here: Pls take responsibility of RIGHTLY using the word MCP if you have the guts…
Kenny I really want to know the joke…
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 12:10 pm
@Deepak,
You are understanding what I’m trying to say here. firstly I wanted to convey that the site mentions “Adjusting rear view mirrors” eve teasing. It does not say Auto or taxi, that means if I adjust the mirrors in my car does it mean eve teasing.
Secondly dont make personal remarks on other, be careful on that.
From the reply you have given I can assume that you have sat with all the girls and the suto driver has adjusted the mirrors all the time.
And the last statement is really true-”We need real people to discuss real issues not boys college drop outs” and I’m sorry to say that you are not matured to discuss.
Comment by Nirmal — August 6, 2008 @ 12:16 pm
“According to a recent survey, 100 percent of female professionals said they had been subjected to sexual harassment by their bosses, 32 percent said they had had intercourse with them at least once and another seven percent claimed to have been raped. ”
Statistically sooooo correct…not just Russia… for the whole world…. 100% harassment…. cos looking is also harassment.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 6, 2008 @ 12:28 pm
@Sanjukta,
If a joke needs an explanation, then its not a joke anymore.
Comment by Nirmal — August 6, 2008 @ 12:31 pm
Read some more comments, can’t resist reacting…
Blank Noise project was started because even when a few of us dared to complaint, our brothers, fathers and boyfriends said “it doesnt exist”. Father said, How come only you complaint, I never heard Mr. Sharma’s daughter complaining, brother scolded, I also travel in the buses I didnt see anything, you must be looking at the guy to know he was looking at you, boyfriend justified, how many times I told you not to wear those clothes (and look ugly).
While I am no fan of Blank noise myself I must say they did give a never before platform for women to write about their experiences, just to create a database which could tell in your face how eveteasing exist in various places, irrespective of what we wear, what time of the day it is, where are we going, who is accompanying us etc.
The idea was to tell you guys, you living in the perfect society, that even though u didn’t notice, it does exist, see here so many women have testified. The idea was not to blame those who didn’t do it, but to proclaim that it exist in much larger numbers than you ever thought, only that earlier woman suppressed because no one wud believer her, now they are expressing.
Kenny and others here who are not guilty themselves, why must you all get defensive? What exactly are you defending by bad mouthing Blank Noise?
When anything become big, it blows a bit out of proportion, that is true with every project every initiative, no organisaion is perfect…the defination of eve teasing is also debatable, depends upon woman to woman, what is okay for me might not be okay for another girl. In that sense to blame any kind of looking or to simply attack asking “why are you looking at me” is exegerration I agree.
That said, some of the comments here are in such bad taste and intellect that I can only pity for men with such mentality, I mean at this age, justifying their frustration by blaming on the woman’s dress is just pathetic.
Deepak has so rightly analysed these men.
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 12:33 pm
@ Sanjukat
As you have rightly said in your comment
“In that sense to blame any kind of looking or to simply attack asking “why are you looking at me” is exegerration I agree. ”
That is all what we are complaining about. Project’s like Blank Noise have become some kind of Anti-Male Campaign…
http://jocalling.blogspot.com/2006/09/of-noise-blank-and-blanknoise_28.html
That is another beautiful post about Blank Noise
Look at your initial Comment, or even Deepak’s initial comments – they were all outburst’s and not weighed comments – or solutions…
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 12:47 pm
@ Sanjukat
“Kenny and others here who are not guilty themselves, why must you all get defensive? What exactly are you defending by bad mouthing Blank Noise?”
That is cause – now you guys are stalking people like us in the name of eve-teasing…
Check out the way’s in which Blank Noise responds to eve-teasing…
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 12:54 pm
@JMJ when you mis-spelled my name it became very suggestive, you’d know if you follow hindi.. Sanju kat. kis ko kaatun? Kya kaatun?
It’s Sanjukta…really how difficult is it..
I don’t agree that is the only point you were making. Your initial comments were plain crazy…not to a female, any sensible male wud find the craziness in your proposition of throne and power play. Just what do you mean by “men would go without a fight?” what was that throne crap all about.
I agree with yon on the co-education thing though, and also agree that creating seperate doors and rooms and seats is not going to help the situation.
Those were the only two points u made rest of it was just gibberish to me…and if you think any of your comment was a SOLUTION…pls suit yourself I won’t argue.
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 1:03 pm
@Kenny
I hope you now noticed that I didn’t call you guys an MCP but your own fellow being called you so. C’mon acknowledge it now..
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 1:06 pm
The idea was to tell you guys, you living in the perfect society, that even though u didn’t notice, it does exist
I did acknowledge that in my post and in my comments many times.
Infact it is discussed so much in newspapers and channels that everyone thinks there is a teaser around every corner. And why do media take this up…. just because it deals with sex.
There is nothing new about blank noise… except that you have managed to pull off some publicity stunt and expanded the teasing dictionary.
A male called me us all MCPs… I acknowledge… does it make any difference…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 6, 2008 @ 1:10 pm
@ sanjukta
“While I am no fan of Blank noise myself I must say they did give a never before platform for women to write about their experiences, just to create a database which could tell in your face how eveteasing exist in various places”
is there any proof that all victim stories there are true?? any person with good imagination can add them. now i don’t say that eve teasing doesnot happen. it does happen but not 24 x 7.
how can u believe in the authenticity of the photograph of the so called ‘teasers’ in that blog. will any teaser pose for a photograph??
the only thing we said was not all men are eve teasers. Not all males are perverts
looking at girls is not eve teasing. there is nothing wrong in glancing a beautiful girl as long as it doesn’t hurt her. 90% males would glance at girls but donot strip them naked with their eyes.
i certainly donot underestimate or under value females and i respect them. but blank noise is a blow up of the issue
Comment by Varun Anand — August 6, 2008 @ 1:45 pm
@Nirmal
“dont make personal comment be careful about that”
I will…kya kar lega be. Kiddos like you need a particular tone or you juz dont get it. As far as maturity is concerned you showed ur standard if eve-teasing according to you is funny. You’re against BN simply coz you’re pro eve teasing Al you need is public thrashing. have a nice laugh
Comment by Mohnish aka Deepak — August 6, 2008 @ 1:48 pm
“looking at girls is not eve teasing. there is nothing wrong in glancing a beautiful girl as long as it doesn’t hurt her”
and you decide what hurtful is and what isnt…people say so what i’m just looking, few say so what im jus admiring, few say so what im just touching, many also believe so what im juz raping … really depends how well you manipulate the perversity
Comment by Mohnish aka Deepak — August 6, 2008 @ 1:53 pm
“And why do media take this up…. just because it deals with sex.”
Finally some sense. I agree completely that the media is sex starved.I’m so sure that some of the perverts derive pleasure in even watching or hearing of rape news and the drama that surrounds it thanks to some of the Hindi News channels …Crap we have to bear but to say sexual harassment is not prevalent in our society is insanely dumb
Comment by Mohnish aka Deepak — August 6, 2008 @ 1:59 pm
@ Sanjukta
“@JMJ when you mis-spelled my name it became very suggestive, you’d know if you follow hindi.. Sanju kat. kis ko kaatun? Kya kaatun?
It’s Sanjukta…really how difficult is it..”
I did study Hindi at school – but since have not really used it much. It was just a typing mistake and not intentional. And I was not the one who suggested – you are the one who came up with the whole new meaning….Just shows how narrow minded you are…
Regarding my earlier posts – I was trying to explain the underlying problem – which I see has not been addressed anywhere…Unless we address these underlying issues, we might as well go back to stone age or put every male in jail.
And talking about solutions – I at least mentioned 2 – what about you??? and please dont take this personally and come up with new suggestions….
@ Deepak
“… really depends how well you manipulate the perversity”
Very true – but did you know that you can manipulate it to the other extreme as well?
And with regards to the Media – Indian media has become just another money spinning machine (just like the rest of the world) – there is no more soul left in the media….
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 3:02 pm
@JMJ
I didn’t know you have to have an emoticon to suggest it was a joke. Did no body see the humor??
ok try reading this again…
“@JMJ when you mis-spelled my name it became very suggestive, you’d know if you follow hindi.. Sanju kat. kis ko kaatun? Kya kaatun?
Comment by Sanjukta — August 6, 2008 @ 3:13 pm
@ Sanjukta
oops!!! you had me there…
For all the other reading the post and the comments, this is also a good read:
http://blog.blanknoise.org/2005/04/he-did-not-touch-me.html#links
http://retributions.wordpress.com/2006/09/28/204/
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 4:47 pm
I was just thinking – what would happen to love at first sight – or second sight or …even the last sight…..if BNP goes around labeling looking & staring as sexual harassment….
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 5:06 pm
I had to use Deepak’s Id coz it wasnt accepting mine for some reason..
This is int read …unfor we dont have watch dogs on Indian streets where the sickos roam freely but hats off wherever the Indian perv goes his very predictable mentality follows
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/12/world/middleeast/12dubai.html
You might argue they too are juz looking
Comment by Mohnish — August 6, 2008 @ 5:20 pm
I see the debate has taken a deviation – which was not intended.
Two days back, I commented here (No.24) and now this is comment No. 73
A lot have happened in between. The major being a strong debate with a nice guy named Deepak
Deepak, We’ve no ill/hatred feelings towards you. We weren’t fighting back to prove you wrong or something.
We were only trying our best to make you (the people) think about WHAT ARE WE SAYING.
WE ARE NOT SAYING
1. that there is no so-called eve-tesing
2. that all girls in India are totally safe
3. that nobody adjusts their rear-view mirrors (:D)
etc etc
We just wanted to higlight that BlankNoise – which has a nice root theme (i.e. to secure females and girls) – is now running wild and now SOUNDS LIKE a Anti-Man revolt.
THAT’s WHAT THIS POST IS ALL ABOUT.
This has nothing to do with pig fights or something that of sort. (I really didn’t knew there existed a phrase like that !!)
I believe that this is what Kenney tried to convey:
▌▌▌▌The movt. is pure of its root theme (i.e. ensure security for females) BUT now it’s spreading like an Anti-Men revolt, which shouldn’t be propagated. ▌▌▌▌
It’s so unfortunate that the debate took an un-needed deviation.
Comment by Aravind Jose T. — August 6, 2008 @ 8:17 pm
m sorry too but i think its a sensitive issue and needs to be given prime importance rather than making it another girl vs boy debate. i stick to what I (deepak if u wanna call me that) have posted. Hope sanity prevails ie if this topic has to continue further.
Comment by Mohnish — August 6, 2008 @ 9:16 pm
@Aravind Jose T,
You are right, the topic has deviated so much and I stopped discussing because Deepak/Mohnish does not show basic respect to others. He may be right in his view, but what ever be the difference of opinion, he should respect others and should not cross limits while commenting. See how he has responded to few comments!
Comment by Nirmal — August 6, 2008 @ 9:26 pm
I have been doing some extensive reading into some of the eve-teasing related Blogs. The one common thing that I have come to notice – is the generalization. And some of the comments take it to the extent where – men and woman might as well be zombies (have no feelings for each other). I thought it was natural for male species to try and woo the female species and then mate….our feminist zealots think otherwise…
Most of the post talk about guy’s not understanding the gals at all….I think I can explain that – Girls just are physiological beings (a touch can mean a 100 things to them) and guys are physical beings (a touch is just a touch.)
So gals dont really expect the guy’s to understand the look-look thing, and guys dont expect the gals to understand the look look thing….
Having said that – the reason why projects like BNP is loosing credibility is – cause they are trying to define eve teasing based on what they think is eve-teasing (looking, staring, adjusting rear-view mirror, asking girl out for coffee…just some examples) – not a social definition.
If men were asked to define Adam-teasing; I guess the following will include as provocation – bending down to pick up anything, Swaying hair from one side to other side, wearing tight cloths, wearing revealing cloths, laughing with friends… the list will be endless…
What one might define as normal behavior might be provocative to the others…this is what we need to do as a society – define the boundaries….not based on feelings or what i thought he thought she thought… but based on a line that is reasonable and acceptable to both sexes.
Our society rule books are still centuries old. Those rules (girls should always stay at home, go out only with a male companion…among others). Now that both the sexes have a equal status – we need to re-write the rules and have them buried into the coming generations as “values”… and this values should apply for both the sexes (girls please dont deny that adam teasing/harassment is not there – now girls are also resorting to openly teasing & harassing men)
This is the only way out – otherwise ladies you are just going to keep complaining and gents – you will also be complaining….
I appreciate the idea behind BNP -but ladies by resorting to generalization, and sensationalism – you are only going to loose valuable support of the good people around you…Eve/Adam teasing is not something that you can go around re-defining every time to suit your needs/your feelings/your…..
Comment by JMJ — August 6, 2008 @ 11:58 pm
@Sanjukta: Gee, I wake up and come to work at 9pm and I see my inbox is flooded with comments from this thread. After reading some of the comments since then, I might retract the PIG epithet, that I’d used to point you here. But still there are quite a few Male chauvinists in this crowd. (btw, i just recalled that JMJ is not a guy, hence affecting my decision significantly). I don’t really subscribe to that all-too-common patriarchal school of thought. If men really think that they want to control society, nothing really stops them from taking it by force. Its happened before and the status quo remains unchanged. The oppression continues, so to say.
Many thousands of years ago, human society was distinctly matriarchal in nature(like several small communities in asia/africa/S.America. These were also our primitive ancestors who worshipped Nature, and its human embodiment : the fertile female(as they saw it). Written History only goes so far back (or has been destroyed) so as to leave no clues as to how,why and when the status quo was reversed. I suspect like many REAL historians(i’m not qualified) that men took over by force. Its also quite possible that the women started abusing their dominance and social stature to abuse the men. Revolution, rioting and restructuring may have happened somewhere along the line.
My point is Control and power eventually leads to oppression of a minority/the marginalized , no matter who.
As you say rightly BNP performed a valuable function by raising awareness about something that menfolk(husbands, brothers and fathers ) preferred to ignore and pretend didn’t happen to anyone they knew. I agree whole heartedly. I sent the link across to my more opinionated female friends and they all CHOSE to ignore the issue saying ‘it wasn’t worth it’. WTF!
You were right about that, Sanjukta. On the spot!
@Kenney, JMJ, Deepak, Nirmal
I don’t have any blanket views on women or men for that matter. Everyone is different and is an individual.
The point continually raised here by the most of the commenters, is the abuse of power that happens at times, encouraged by hype generated by projects like BNP.
Hyppothetical situation: What if I decided to ask a girl out to coffee after a chance encounter? If (god forbid my HORRIBLE STINKING luck) she’s a militant feminist of some sort who instantly spots a ‘Harasser’, and asks me to pose for a snap and posts it on BNP on the Blacklist. WTF. Any human being would be annoyed and hurt.
I am extremely concerned about any form of extremism and fanaticism. Terrorists who use bombs aren’t the only fanatics around.
I’ve observed that this discussion has matured somewhat. Statements and POVs have been revised and re-phrased.
This is exactly what I hope the purpose of BNP is.(or it should be) i.e raising awareness and educating. I’m glad for all.
Signed, ….
well whats the point, anybody could use anyone’s name on a blog right?
Comment by Vimal George — August 7, 2008 @ 12:02 am
@ Vimal
It is nice to see more and more mature comments coming through after the initial emotional outburst’s. And I would like to see more such people debating not so hot topics as well. I am sure most of us now have a broader view than when we started off.
And Guess what I am a 24 year old male working in the computer industry – far away from India…and I know Kenney Jacob very well (he was my class mate) and I can tell you that he is not a Male chauvinist (maybe a little tech chauvinist but certainly not Male chauvinist) …
That was the whole point of the post – the kind of approach adopted by BNP is over the edge – there fore setting off good neutral people like Kenney and myself against them. If BNP had stuck to the basics – I am sure that Kenney and myself and the so called Male chauvinists will have no problems supporting their cause
Comment by JMJ — August 7, 2008 @ 2:07 pm
For curiosity sakes what according to you are the basics that BNP should have stuck to?
Every now n then there are hints of chauvinism which even my female friends point out in me but I accept them now rather than fight it out to prove I’ the man and I’m always right! And I think thats where the role of society should be questioned. Our ancient beliefs, our double standards, our cinema everything needs revamping. Chk Post #41 if only my own friends could unlearn a lotta things…
Lets face it men will never know what women have to face, juz the fact that they find some of the definitions ‘funny’ is proof enough similar way women will never understand what men go thru when they’re falsely accused of sexual harassment (I’m one of em) or rape but that doesnt mean you conclude by saying all men are pervs and all women are liars.
Comment by Mohnish — August 7, 2008 @ 3:08 pm
@ Mohnish
Basics – well I did leave it wide open….
Well for one thing – Blogging about personal experiences is a great Idea – it gives those woman a great platform to vent out their own frustration… of course
Advising Woman on how to handle such situations – so that it does not get out of hand…(in a nutshell – advice people to use the power they have responsibly)
I am sure we can find some thing sensational from time to time to promote it….
From your post…
“And I think that’s where the role of society should be questioned”
you have diagnosed the problem right – it is not a problem with men or women alone – it is a social problem… and we have to make it a social issue…
“doesnt mean you conclude by saying all men are pervs and all women are liars”
At least now we are concur on a few things…it should not be made into another men vs women thing…
Comment by JMJ — August 7, 2008 @ 3:42 pm
On a very different note, I don’t think Blank Noise is so big tht you guys would actually have to stand organised and united against it. You all must be awefully insecure to bother about Blank Noise Initiatives, coz they are just mere initiatives, you can leave them alone really.
Would be better if you’d engage in something more important
Comment by Sanjukta — August 7, 2008 @ 3:49 pm
@ Sanjukta
BNP being big or not is not at all an issue…if they continue along the same path of using the power they have irresponsibly – they are bound to die out some time or the other….
About standing up – I think this post helped me in forming a opinion on two things
1. eve teasing – being part of this discussion has made me do my research into eve-teasing and formulate an opinion for myself. This is the first time in my life that I got a serious chance to discuss about eve-teasing; otherwise tomorrow when I have children and they would have asked me about eve-teasing I would have nothing really to tell them.
2.BNP – There are people out there who are doing something about eve-teasing – but in the wrong way…
What I would like to see is more weighted opinion from women – especially the older ones (that is cause they have seen more of life than you and me and more importantly have seen the change – My mom would love to give her opinion – unfortunately she does not know how to use the computer and like her we are loosing out on lot of older peoples wise opinion…)
“Would be better if you’d engage in something more important”
Guess what we do have more important work to do – Kenny is in charge of the technical division of a leading mobile media providers in south India and has his leg in 100 different projects (http://d.olph.in) and I am running all the operations for a Computer company somewhere in Africa….But this is also important to us – cause these are the small ways in which we can contribute back to our society and help it become better…
And I bet you also have more important things to do in life – but you took the time to sit and type something – that itself shows that there are good people around and they care…
Comment by JMJ — August 7, 2008 @ 4:57 pm
I’m glad you’ve acknowledged ur inexperience when it comes to discussing abt sexual harassment. For some reason I’m against the term ‘eve teasing’…IMO it makes a serious offense like sexual harassment a trivial topic for discussion…
“I would like to see is more weighted opinion from women – especially the older ones”
r they the ones who go thru harassment daily to tell y wht they think??? No in fact many times its parents who advise the daughter to keep mum. very few parents decide to speak up against those rascals simply coz safety is an issue. What if the ne time the girl is returning home an the SOB throws acid coz she dared to speak is a common fear amongst parents.
Times werent the same when my mom was out there as it is when my sister or girlfriend is NOW. My mom was confined to the 4 corners b4 marriage (except during college) and even after marriage.
“There are people out there who are doing something about eve-teasing – but in the wrong way…”
Again show us the path, the right one o Sir! I think its a great initiative.
Comment by Mohnish — August 7, 2008 @ 5:47 pm
@ Mohnish
“For some reason I’m against the term ‘eve teasing’…IMO it makes a serious offense like sexual harassment a trivial topic for discussion…”
I agree – things like “asking out for coffee, looking…” etc should not be included under Harassment and things like “groping, taking pictures…” should be included under Harassment punishable by law….
U under estimate older women my friend – you say that they are the ones that ask you to keep mum – but do you know how observant they are – why do you think they advice their daughters to wear non-reveling cloths and stay out of the dark? U might think that they are sitting and sleeping or praying – but they see quite a few things that we don’t notice…And in most of the cases of Harassment they are the first ones to speak out. You speak the truth when you say they choose to keep mum – but try and give them a platform… u will be surprised.
And moreover – older people generally have more patience and willingness to listen – instead of going on an emotional rout…and “though the internet has taken over as the source for all information – people are still the source for wisdom”
The path…
yea I was kidding…
get off your PC – open your gate and look outside – you will see the path……..
To tell you the truth – I have no clue where to start. But I guess we just have to start talking about it…
Comment by JMJ — August 7, 2008 @ 9:00 pm
“The path…
get off your PC – open your gate and look outside – you will see the path……..”
I did exactly that bro, just that i didnt juz see it, comment but I’m walking it right now and I would urge each n every individual (man or woman) to do the same
a link for some people’s benefit…be it a raste ka romeo or a gorgeous model in a pub
eve teasing (sexual harassment) is a crime but the prob is no1 cares a damn about it
http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=rAfHIZcFa9A&feature=related
“asking out for coffee, looking…”
asking out for coffee – ive done that a lot but never by making chumma chatu sounds, or by saying hai item chalti hai kya? or by using offensive pickup lines.
As humans attraction is very normal but what goes on our streets is not an excuse for that…When my friends talk about a girl there are a few who say “sexy B***s man” Is that the way you describe a human?
Whats the use of all the ‘education’ and Mba degrees if you dont have basic respect for another life? This is something that the best Univ dont teach you.
and no I dont expect much from the older generations, u call it practicality or patience , I call it cowardice or fear. I have high expectations from todays youth but every now n then that faith is shattered when I see and read such blogs
Jai Bharat Maa (Jai bharat Baap if ppl take offense becoz of the ‘thrown’ n all)
Comment by Mohnish — August 7, 2008 @ 9:37 pm
@ Mohnish
There you go – all emotional again…
http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=l6N-1vk52Cc&feature=related
Watch the video – should make you smile
Stop thinking emotionally and start working towards practical solutions. This might mean that girls have to still put up with some low power eve-teasing. I would like to know in which court you will convict someone who called a girl “hey baby”…and what kind of punishment you will you hand over?…may be 30 days in jail will teach him a lesson.
Just for one second – be practical…
In the above mentioned scenario I would prefer that the girl ignore the person, ask a counter question or even go up to the extent to slapping the person if the situation demands.
Every time some one tries to abuse you – they are trying to take control over you – and every time you burst out emotionally in such situation – you are actually letting the abuser control you. The power over your self is the ultimate power – so don’t abuse it or don’t let anybody else abuse it.
Like I said – anything physical can be dealt with inside the preview of Law itself – in rest of the cases – people have to use their power and exercise it with a lot of responsibility.
So brother – dont loose heart – watch this video
http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=Kk6Bi23Q7-E&feature=related
This is certainly a practical solution…
Comment by JMJ — August 7, 2008 @ 11:11 pm
seen this b4 and laughed, there are newer ones if u want links
“This might mean that girls have to still put up with some low power eve-teasing.”
Sounds more like a threat than a solution to me. Bachna ae haseeno lo main aa gaya?
“I would prefer that the girl ignore the person, ask a counter question or even go up to the extent to slapping the person if the situation demands.”
Unfor I would love that as well but first they need to be empowered and coming to empowerment i think BNP is trying to do exactly that by questioning silly myths like girls shd not step out in the dark, should not wear tight clothes and walk indian streets. Its gonna happen newaz even if shes dressed in a salwar. Most women find is so damn emb to talk abt what shes bin thru u expect her to ask counter questions or slap…Gee why didnt they think of this b4. look out for another link there ’spectators’ i think u belong to that category. We have a whole bunch watching the tamasha but no1 has the b***s to do something abt it…
as far as the vid is concerned they still dont show the woman giving a chamat to the SOB which i would love to see.
i sent the link coz it was relevant to one of the topics unfor u saw the funny side to it and must i repeat juz the way u initially found eve teasing funny. Have a nice laugh and a nice life
Comment by Mohnish — August 8, 2008 @ 3:49 pm
@ Mohnish
“Sounds more like a threat than a solution to me”
I was taking about a compromise situation…
“myths like girls shd not step out in the dark, should not wear tight clothes and walk indian streets.”
Sure I agree these are myths…but in a society that has been conservative (read it as abusive to woman – if you want to) – a woman walking in tight cloths will be a sight to see for the men for the near future…
Brother you have to be patient – if you want to change the world – things can change over night – but people cannot change overnight…
“Unfor I would love that as well but first they need to be empowered ”
Do you think you can change the way the society behaves towards the girls – overnight – or even the way the girls behave towards the hooligans on the street overnight? First you have to make the society realize that it is not acceptable.
For most of the hooligans out there in the street – eve teasing is just fun or pass time – it is just a way of proving to your buddy who the king is (peer preassure). Only in few cases is it serious enough to lead on to other things. I am in no way justifying whatever they are doing.
Empowering women is a long process and this process was set into motion long ago – at least now the girls have started wearing tight cloths….and now it is going to take a few more generations before all this stigma against women is gone…
“Have a nice laugh and a nice life
”
Yes boss! I am going to have a nice life – no matter what happens out there – my life is to precious to waste on some hooligans…
Comment by JMJ — August 8, 2008 @ 9:21 pm
a man is not defined as some1 who is good at flirting with, teasing a woman but one who shows basic respect towards her irrespective of her attire, language, habits etc
Unfortunately as a lesbian friend aptly points out “not too many men out there” :I
Comment by Mohnish — August 8, 2008 @ 11:54 pm
I am really sorry that most of the men do not fit into your or your “lesbian” friend’s definition of “MAN”
Comment by JMJ — August 9, 2008 @ 3:35 pm
wonder y the ” ” for lesbian …what happ u have probs with their existence as well?
and i am sorry (for me of course) coz im still expecting a lil bit of sense from a huge pile of obsolete trash.
“http://www.kenneyjacob.com/2008/08/03/blank-noise-feminist-bull-shit/”
Comment by Mohnish — August 9, 2008 @ 4:02 pm
@ Monish
Why are getting emotional buddy ? Stay cool and stick to the discussion…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 9, 2008 @ 4:04 pm
Heh. So funny. 18 years of bus travel and never seen a girl get harrassed. You don’t need the dark glasses buddy, you were born with them. Don’t worry about ‘feminists’ hassling you.
Sheesh…
Comment by Sue — August 10, 2008 @ 2:59 am
The writer (I will call him Ken) does a poor job of assessing the extent of eve-teasing based on the experiences of a few – the sincerity of whom (including that of the writer himself) is not beyond question. But questions of sincerity aside, Ken does not take into account the fact that eve-teasing in many cases is not obvious except to the eve-teaser and his victim, and the latter, for a variety of reasons, doesn’t generally bring the attention of the surrounding people to that incident. It is in fact this very nature of most victims that emboldens the eve-teasers to continue their deeds with impunity. Blank Noise has done a good job of emphasizing on this particular aspect of eve-teasing. (It is a different matter of course, that some people make extra efforts to ignore those facts that threaten their preexisting conceptions.) Therefore, personal non-experiences of a few males are not necessarily any close to capturing the extent of eve-teasing on the Indian streets.
Coming back to Ken’s own fear of girls, there is merely a vague mention of being a victim of the so-called “fear of being teased” without any “quantification” that the writer himself expects from others. Did Ken have any bad experiences in which girls accused him of being an eve-teaser? Did his friends have any such experiences? How many? How often? In the absence of a discussion on these topics, his blanket fear of girls sounds more like early man’s fear of the supernatural, which of course most of us would agree is completely irrational and a product of ignorance.
Comment by Lazy Tiger — August 10, 2008 @ 8:41 am
@above
Reminds me of the Accenture ad
“Just another day at the office for a tiger” Second with every point made by you Sir/Ma’m
Comment by Mohnish — August 10, 2008 @ 1:12 pm
@ Monish & Deepak,
Guyz dont waste time by arguing with these paverts..
By bringing this topic like this clearly says which part of society do they belong..They have proved that either they don have any mother sister or wife and if they have any bychance then they have never cared for them.. Another reason can be lack of conversation with females (dats y they r so frustated in life) or may be none of the female must have looked at them..
Monish please understand their feelings… Frustation leads to all dis.. what best they can do is discuss it out .. But the fact is
IF A GUY RUNS NUDE ON THE STREET NONE OF THE GIRL WILL EVEN GLARE HIM ONCE (INFACT ITS A HORRABLE SIGHT) AND ON THE OTHER HAND IF A GIRL WEARS SHORT SLEAVES GUYS START MANAGING THEIR PANTS..
And then dey say dat who is facinated for girls.?????HAH
I really think that instead of protesting .. We shuld just chop dat P****e of the person who do eve teasing or any other disgraceful act..
THEN IT WILL EASY FOR US TO COUNT THE NUMBER..and u kno then we wont have to waste time on such blogs too……
Woooooooooot say
Comment by shradha — August 11, 2008 @ 12:36 pm
Guyz dont waste time by arguing with these paverts..
Come on…. this is a discussion… and not a fight…
Another reason can be lack of conversation with females (dats y they r so frustated in life) or may be none of the female must have looked at them..
ahhh there comes female arrogance…… Stick to the point lady…
i think you are very emotional… cos you misspelled a lot of words… calm down.. and we will discuss…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 11, 2008 @ 1:01 pm
sweethrt.. bottom line is to convey the point… i m really not ideal like many of you hu can sit and do spell chk.. i dono wether u use cell fone or no.. but its known as short conversation..
And ur right dat m emotional … and really emotional bout dis topic….and i think everyone shuld.. gone r d days when women use to be worshipd in india..
I do understan dat women demselvs r responsible to a large extent but .. it doesnt mean dat they loose respect…
Comment by shradha — August 11, 2008 @ 1:20 pm
I do understan dat women demselvs r responsible to a large extent but .. it doesnt mean dat they loose respect…
I wont agree to that statement. Women are not responsible for being teased. If in any case they are… then that’s not teasing…
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 11, 2008 @ 1:23 pm
“i think you are very emotional”
You keep saying this … do u not get this only an emotionless person would agree to what u have posted Anger is the obvious emotion most have felt be it man or woman. Do u understand the insensitive nature of this blog If educated citizens start arguing what is teasing what is not God save us all.
If your wife, sister, girlfriend is constantly stared at a restaurant or coffee shop making her feel uncomfy will u start arguin “relax babe this is not eve teasing”
Comment by Mohnish — August 11, 2008 @ 2:39 pm
@Lazy Tiger
“It is a different matter of course, that some people make extra efforts to ignore those facts that threaten their preexisting conceptions.”
The indifference of the Indian Community is a whole new topic to talk about.
“in many cases is not obvious except to the eve-teaser and his victim”
Absolutely true – maybe that is why people like Kenney have not seen anything…And if the above statement is true – why is it that the victim’s are not responding immediately? (are they enjoying it in some way?) and getting the people around them involved? I am sure that the general people in India like taking to task someone – once after someone (especially woman) have raced their voice…
“Blank Noise has done a good job of emphasizing on this particular aspect of eve-teasing.”
Yes BNP has given a platform to bring to fore front this topic – but now this platform is being misused & abused (which is what this post is all about)
“Coming back to Ken’s own fear of girls”
Maybe his fear is misplaced – but the way BNP is portraying eve-teasing Tomorrow all the men will have to be fearful.
@Sue
“You don’t need the dark glasses buddy, you were born with them.”
If BNP’s definition of eve-teasing is going to be accepted as the official charter against eve-teasing – I would say Kenny is very lucky to be born with dark glasses…
@Shradha
“Guyz dont waste time by arguing with these paverts..”
I have no Idea on what basis you called every one perverts – but going by your word – if every one on this post was a pervert – we actually wont be discussing this topic at all, we would rather be looking at pornography…
“IF A GUY RUNS NUDE ON THE STREET NONE OF THE GIRL WILL EVEN GLARE HIM ONCE (INFACT ITS A HORRABLE SIGHT)”
I still dont understand this reaction of girls – what is in fact so horrible about a nude man? Physically a man and a woman are the same – except for their re-productive organs…No wonder we have gay’s and Lesbians now a days.
“ON THE OTHER HAND IF A GIRL WEARS SHORT SLEAVES GUYS START MANAGING THEIR PANTS”
Unfortunately men are visual beings – a sight like that may send their testosterone shooting up…
“We shuld just chop dat P****e of the person”
oops…well I do not need to comment on that…
“I do understan dat women demselvs r responsible to a large extent but”
I do agree with you to some extent – but the ratio of girls Inviting it to that of the eve-teasers starting it for no apparent reason need’s to be debated.
@Shradha @ Mohnish
“i think you are very emotional”
You can be passionate – but when you get emotional your brain tends to mix your emotions with facts & fiction. The chances emotional decision generally ending up in trouble are very high – compared to a rational decision based on facts. We do understand your anger – but getting angry does not solve any problems.
Comment by JMJ — August 11, 2008 @ 3:41 pm
Mr. JMJ..
Tanx fa ur deep evaluation..
Well i would suggest u to again read my blog as it clearly mentions perverts to those hu r arguing without steppin in d real world.
I do understan d biological diffrence between men and women but with dat i understan dat both carry same feelings and being in India a woman can harris guy in more horreble way (law itself favours woman more then man..)but still women r bound by culture and family driven values..we should consider dat although woman r capable of troubling or even ruining d guyz life still they tolerate upto a gr8 extent
“The chances emotional decision generally ending up in trouble are very high – compared to a rational decision based on facts. We do understand your anger – but getting angry does not solve any problems.”
Well on dis i just wana say dat i would rather b angry and slap or kick an eve teaserb then to rationalise decision on facts..
Regards
Comment by shradha — August 11, 2008 @ 4:02 pm
@shradha
“(law itself favours woman more then man..)but still women r bound by culture and family driven values..”
Absolutely true. This is where I said that we need a fundamental change in our society in the way that men behave towards women and women towards men – this should be based on equality and equality alone (not on religion, cast, political party….)
“Well on dis i just wana say dat i would rather b angry and slap or kick an eve teaserb then to rationalise decision on facts..”
This is exactly how I would like a girl to respond to harassment/abuse. I was referring to the tone and content of some of the post’s when I said an emotional approach will not work in a discussion…
Comment by JMJ — August 11, 2008 @ 5:05 pm
For all of you who aren’t aware:
BNP defines street sexual harrassment by asking people on the roads what they think consitutes molestation. Boards are left in public spaces for people to register their opinions and an online poll was conducted along similar lines.
Men and women called a variety of things harassment but I think we all — even the author of this blog — understand that different behaviours mean different things to each person. Usually this is because person A has been subjected to ‘Looking’ beyond common decency while person B has never had that problem but has had taxi drivers adjust their rear view mirror to reflect their bust/groin. Until this happens to YOU, it’s very difficult to comprehend how invasive such a thing can be.
BNP keeps re-working the notion of what is eve teasing purely because of this variety. It is not just about one person (man or woman’s) personal fears but more about what is acceptable behaviour in public.
To that extent I invite, on behalf of BNP members and associates around the world, people who are genuinely interested in working out the boundaries of street behaviour to take this discussion to the BNP blog where it is always welcome.
Comment by Sue — August 11, 2008 @ 5:19 pm
taxi drivers adjust their rear view mirror to reflect their bust/groin
This is new information to me. I never knew something like this existed.
Anyways I have decided to do a proper survey about eve teasing.
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 11, 2008 @ 5:30 pm
Finally.
Glad that someone ‘got’ it.
Comment by Vimal George — August 11, 2008 @ 6:08 pm
@JMJ
“It is a different matter of course, that some people make extra efforts to ignore those facts that threaten their preexisting conceptions.”
I think u missed the point completely LT was trying to make there but i dont blame u nor do i have patience to explain
And if the above statement is true – why is it that the victim’s are not responding immediately? (are they enjoying it in some way?)
Yes Yes all the perpetrators feel the same thats y they do it in the 1st place… sick minds think alike
I am sure that the general people in India like taking to task someone – once after someone (especially woman) have raced their voice…
Good point but there are instances where mobs end up teasing, molesting women what do u do in that case. there was a time women were advised to go where there were crowds now what new advice do we have to give them
How abt look like men to avoid other men
Yes BNP has given a platform to bring to fore front this topic – but now this platform is being misused & abused (which is what this post is all about)
This is one place where a great initiative is being misused in the name of a healthy discussion but the best thing is its only gonna get BIGGER. the more u resist the more it persists.
I personally wanted more ppl to know abt BN thank u for ur efforts guys
GO BNP
“but the way BNP is portraying eve-teasing Tomorrow all the men will have to be fearful.”
I’m not …Are you???
“I still dont understand this reaction of girls – what is in fact so horrible about a nude man? Physically a man and a woman are the same – except for their re-productive organs…No wonder we have gay’s and Lesbians now a days.”
I’m sorry but thats my reaction as well. Nothing girlie about it I hope. be it a drug addict on the street or a hunk in my gym locker room thats not what I like to see.
Man and women according to u are physically diff but emotionally, psychologically ??? aha u c thats where u guys got it wrong in the 1st place and …..ahhh 4get it
“We do understand your anger – but getting angry does not solve any problems.”
i dont agree with that as well. Anger I think is an awesome emotion if the intent behind it is good…is it adding value???…m sure the creator of the blog had a lil bit anger coz the definitions of eve teasing pissed him off a bit or maybe m juz speculating. Most sensitive people do have tremendous amt of energy, ppl like to call it anger. Mind you an angry person doesnt necessarily scream, abuse or is violent. In fact the greatest freedom fighter , the Mahatma was an angry man (if u’d like to believe his existence ie) but ironically he won with non violence …I dont believe every1 to follow wht m saying but then I dont care as well
Ps: Shradz is a dear friend. thanks for sharing sweety
Best,
Comment by Mohnish — August 11, 2008 @ 6:38 pm
@ Mohnish
I am not really sure what you are out to prove but:
“I dont believe every1 to follow wht m saying but then I dont care as well
”
I think that says it all…
Comment by JMJ — August 11, 2008 @ 7:24 pm
Comment by Mohnish — August 11, 2008 @ 8:22 pm
The crocodile story:
There was once a group of Crocodiles. They formed a blog. The Crocodiles decide to stand still on red lights – and with “Y R U Looking at me” printed on their chest. A lot of crocodiles came to the website and all of them cried. Then they decided that they are going to put up photo’s of Innocent looking men and build a stupid story around them. They claimed that there were so many crocodiles around so they had the right to do what ever they liked.
This is in response to this post:
http://blog.blanknoise.org/2008/07/blank-noised-men.html#links
Just shows how serious these people are…
@Sue
“To that extent I invite, on behalf of BNP members and associates around the world, people who are genuinely interested in working out the boundaries of street behaviour to take this discussion to the BNP blog where it is always welcome.”
Thank you very much for inviting us Sue. But I think we are better off taking about this issue on this blog.
Comment by JMJ — August 11, 2008 @ 9:40 pm
“But I think we are better off taking about this issue on this blog.”
Ah WTF we dont need ranting and raving cowards newaz
Comment by Jenny — August 11, 2008 @ 10:39 pm
@JMJ
“why is it that the victim’s are not responding immediately? (are they enjoying it in some way?)”
The more likely reasons include being ashamed, scared, lack of courage, not wanting to create a “scene”…
“Yes BNP has given a platform to bring to fore front this topic – but now this platform is being misused & abused…”
Saying that eve-teasing could include staring or adjusting the rear view mirror is equivalent to abuse??? Somehow there seems to be more concern over such trivialities here than over real issues.
” (which is what this post is all about)”
Just to remind you – The writer does not confine himself to BNP.
“…but the way BNP is portraying eve-teasing Tomorrow all the men will have to be fearful.”
Don’t speak for all men please!
Comment by Lazy Tiger — August 13, 2008 @ 4:57 am
@ Lazy Tiger
“Saying that eve-teasing could include staring or adjusting the rear view mirror is equivalent to abuse???”
Well If they had stopped by at that – at least it would have passed off as some kind of joke. But take a look at their “Unwanted Eve Teasers” List.
“Don’t speak for all men please!”
I was not. I speak for myself only. I was only warning the others.
Comment by JMJ — August 13, 2008 @ 10:12 pm
The ‘men’ dont need warnings from boys. We know what we are doing…
Comment by Jenny — August 13, 2008 @ 10:40 pm
The ‘men’ dont need warnings from boys. We know what we are doing…
Comment by mohnish — August 13, 2008 @ 10:41 pm
@JMJ
Yes, I looked at it. Please be more specific as to what your issue is with that “unwanted” list. What exactly do you consider to be “abuse” here? What is it about that list that makes you have such a strong negative opinion on BNP?
Comment by Lazy Tiger — August 14, 2008 @ 6:19 am
@mohnish and jenny
Are you the same person?
Comment by Lazy Tiger — August 14, 2008 @ 6:41 am
No we’re not
i had to use her id coz it doesnt seem to accept mine at times
Deepak and Mohnish same person though
Comment by mohnish — August 14, 2008 @ 12:01 pm
Well.. I cannot agree with you guys… Dress matters??? Girls provoke?? Eve teasing complaints are raised by FEMINISTS only??? Isnt all this a crap??? Bull shit!!
Kenney if you wanna see eve teasing happens or not, please try to make a practise of traveling in KSRTC buses and try to step out of your car(Optra right?). Buddy, the eve teasing occurs with that majority masses(females ofcourse) who are forced to choose public traffic to travel, cos they cant afford to have their own vehicle. You can see a lot of females who use this means of transport to travel. And imagine a girl, just wearing a salwar-kameez(decent huh) boarding a bus which is tightly packed, and this poor soul has no other choice but to board this. She just trying to stand properly, if not on her tip toes(cos the rush ofcourse). How can she provoke a man??? She intentionally doesn’t seem to do anything that can provoke a man. Here the “dress” is decent, she is not even bothering to see the person who is standing next to her(whether a guy or a gal). How can she provoke or invite someone??
And if you notice, you can find some so called GENTLEMEN just trying to d social service by letting everyone move to the front area of the bus & poor ‘HE’ managing to stand to the rear side of the bus so that he can give his body as well as his eyes a treat(even thought a small one)…
Ofcourse I do agree that if gals wear a li’l catchy(tight fit/deep neck like this goes on the classification) dress
then its another case and she need to go for her private vehicle to travel.. cos u cant expect guys to be nice.. They cant be.. the reason they give is that ‘how can a bee just have a glance of honey and cant leave it untasted?’ Nah??? Well thats the attitude seen in a lot of people…
Imagine if thieves start using this argument & they try to justify their robbery?? They will claim that these people were living a Porsche life & were possessing all the things that a man desires to have in his lifetime.. They will say that they were just “PROVOKED” by the way this man was showing his luxury.. Well..!! Now you need to think of another statement that can cut this argument!!
Fine…!! lets keep eve teasing to a side for time being.
How about molestation/rape of kids starting from 1.5 year old(who lost her ability to speek when she was brutally raped by her grandpa) & kids in schools…??
Justification can be given for anything… But people, just think.. what if same happens with your wife/sis/daughter/mom/grandma(even they are not spared these days)??? How will you justify that act??? Just because your kid was 1-2 year old and she wasn’t wearing anything other than her sleeveless top & mini skirts… Or your grandma who started using clothes to a minimum level cos she fins it hard to manage her self
Please provide a justification for this…
Comment by Neena — August 18, 2008 @ 9:19 am
I didnt justify eve teasing. Go through the entire comments section (if you have time)….
And about the KSRTC thing, we also dont have a choice. What are we supposed to do in a crowded bus, avoid public transport ? Are you suggesting that buses are crowded just for teasing ?
Now think about this… why is it that we are always accused of enjoying ? Cant it be embarrassing for us too ?
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 18, 2008 @ 9:32 am
We??? No buddy… that was a gyan for the mass who are the one who perform this art of eve teasing.. I believe that you dont fall in that group…
I didnt ask you to avoid public transport… But its not you who does the eve teasing.. There are a couple of dedicated artist for it… And buses are not crowded for this reason.. But ofcourse you hear/experience a lot of these stuffs in them only…
Eve teasers will always be accused for enjoying.. But not the rest of the masses… Cos they have better things to do…
Comment by Neena — August 18, 2008 @ 9:40 am
There are a couple of dedicated artist for it…
Exactly the point of this post also…
There are a couple of dedicated artists for every other crime also
Comment by Kenney Jacob — August 18, 2008 @ 9:43 am
But still.. I cant accept you feminist usage here.. Your lines”I am not saying that teasing is non existent. But I am sure this is not happening to an extent, these attention seeking feminist psychos think. I have never seen not even one instance of teasing in public. ”
And certainly I do agree that adjusting of rear view mirror cannot be counted as this art..
Comment by Neena — August 18, 2008 @ 9:49 am
heat!!!!!so hot here!!!!!!!!!!
Comment by sreehari — August 18, 2008 @ 9:59 am
[...] we were having a very hot discussion about BNP (Blank Noise Project) and eve-teasing. The argument of the post was as [...]
Pingback by What Blank Noise Project is All About | Disruptive Technologies and Education — August 21, 2008 @ 12:35 am
Kenny you are either will fully blind or else a sad pathetic individual. I see Sexual harassment (eve teasing) happen so frequently enough. My sister herself has suffered the same. Thank fully not all men have the appalling lack of self control you think they do. If a man looks at woman and can’t control his desires, then obviously his parents and society have done a lousy job of raising him. I know many guys who have never harassed a woman and yet not had to constrain themselves to any of the limitations you believe are so necessary.
Comment by jonathan — September 14, 2008 @ 2:48 am
It is best to ignore females unless you have to look at them and talk to them for some good reason. Females crave attention from males, and when they get it they complain. It is best to treat them as though they do not exist!
Comment by Dev — October 23, 2008 @ 10:12 am
the thread seems dead, but i will say this…
i suppose i qualify as an older woman, being 37. the worst incident i can recall is one where i was in a local train. packed ladies compartment at rush hour. women going to school & work. a couple of men, regular teasers from the adjoining compartment (normally they would call out obscenities) decided to jump into the ladies’ compartment as the train picked up speed. they got in, but in the ensuing struggle, a girl fell out and got crushed under the train.
yeah i guess you will say this is a rare event, and dismiss it from your discussion. but what of that girl’s life? i have in my time in india 3 times spoken out with spontaneous anger at perverts who thought it was perfectly ok to touch me in crowded buses. and there have been innumerable times where men would openly stare at me – to embarrassedly look away when i’d simply ask them – “Kya?”. space and respect is all i ask for.
it took me a long time to get over the anger. i have always advocated for speaking out, when women around me would tell me to shut up, ignore, or the men around me would be in denial about the issue. i now live abroad in a big city where it has been possible for me to intellectualize the issue, since i can walk around freely with people not leering at me, and generally treating me as a co-human.
BNP i thought was an important development, bringing the issue out into the open. allowing people to express openly their experiences. the art part of it may not be to everyone’s taste, but the issue is relevant, and merits dialogue, not name-calling, or quoting out of context.
i will stop, though, with an incident i witnessed in a city in Europe. i was out with my European friends, who are quite beautiful, and always dress tastefully, elegantly. we were out in the city center walking in the early afternoon, when a bunch of men decided to walk into us, shoving at least two of us with their elbows. i am sorry to say these were indian immigrant workers.
please feel free to look at me. but please, don’t leer at me, don’t lower yourselves. if i don’t look back, maybe i’m not interested or maybe i’m married. have some dignity. treat each other with respect, dialogue with each other, and the right person, man or woman will be there for you.
Comment by some gal — November 13, 2008 @ 2:09 am
@ Some gal
No this thread is not dead – as long as people like you and me who are concerned about this issue are around.
As for the guys who caused the accident – they should booked for “Attempt Murder”
Dear Gal – We in no way support eve-teasing. We only have a problem with the numbers BNP claim and the way BNP is portraying the issue
I would ask other ladies to pick up a leaf or two from your experience and speak up against eve-teasing.
Please read our next post here. We have pointed out specific Issues here.
While we have expressed our opinion here – if we have quoted BNP out of context – we have not blocked any attempt by BNP to correct us – instead what we see is some of BNP’s hard core fans just talking nonsense!
“have some dignity. treat each other with respect”
That is exactly what we are saying – Respect is something that you give and take – if BNP continues on this line of using sensationalism and making it a girl vs boy thing – they are going to loose the respect.
Comment by JMJ — November 13, 2008 @ 6:25 pm
For a second there I was confused about the difference between teasing and eve teasing.
Anyway I think feminists have a noble goal of at least securing the rights that women do deserve. But I agree, most feminists are absolutely clueless. They are only after an ideal: get women more rights. If they took a step back and took a look at the big picture, they’d see a double standard where they are actually subjecting men to their bullshit. Its a matter of degree, for example democracy is liberal; anarchy is even more liberal but is it better?
Most feminists I gather become so because that is what others say they should be. Yeah… way to take some initiative of your own. It really shows that you have manly powers… following the pack… even though you are a woman.
Comment by CG Cummings — December 4, 2008 @ 10:42 am
I am neither a feminist nor a male hater. I AM a victim of men staring, pinching, groping, getting followed for 45 mins by a car while i walk, giving me notes, asking me if i need a lift, getting whistled at, asking if i want to have sex while i am just walking, and it happens to me everyday..
You may not see this happening, cos it isnt happening to you. Open your eyes, follow the eyes of the men you share a train compartment with or a bus or even while sitting and having coffee and maybe you will see.
Is this blog aimed at dissing people trying to do something for society? NOt to mention- full of frustrated men.
Comment by Kismet — April 1, 2009 @ 7:27 am
My neighbor’s dead dog needs to go for a walk. Who is free? I mean all of you are but..who is MORE free?
Comment by M. — April 1, 2009 @ 7:45 am
Are you guys for real? I am a girl from middle class family and I can say I do not know of any woman who wasnt groped, stared at or sexually insulted by men atleast once in their lives.
There is nothing feministic about raising your voice against this harassment. Ask your sister or your mother if you hvae one. Or better still ask your wife over whom you have asked your fellow men to take revenge.
For perverts like you normal social life is groping at women. Real men do not do that!
Comment by Shilpa — April 17, 2009 @ 7:44 pm
I am just shocked that the men here are so incredulous when faced with the idea that sexual harrassment of women is widespread. What do you expect … that women announce to their classmates, friends or even to their families each time that they were sexually harrassed? How on earth do you expect to get an idea of the scale of this issue from personal experience or first-hand accounts?
Comment by Sohan — April 26, 2009 @ 12:21 pm
This forum is absolutely disgusting, and it is precisely because of men like you bunch that Blank Noise has to work as hard as they do to dispel common notions and myths.
For those of you who think eve teasing is a myth, ask a girl about it (not male friends… because women tend not to indulge in such lewd behaviour).
Oh also, you look exactly like the kinda person threatened by such a campaign…a closet eve teaser.
For those of you who think women should wear veils and sit at home to stay safe, let me remind you society punishes criminals and not innocent persons – do you sit at home for fear of being mugged ? whose fault is it if you get robbed ?
why does fault reverse with eve teasing ?
Dare to confront the truth, instead of hiding in cowardice. Don’t feel threatened by women raising their voices because it hinders your ability to eve tease without being caught out…
Comment by Madhu — May 31, 2009 @ 5:57 pm
Thanks to this guy, there is voice to the patriarchal male mind and ego. It is out in full public view what the ‘educated Indian male’ thinks of feminism and a woman’s rights to basic equality. As Madhu said rightly, tehse are the guys that make us work as hard as we have to…God bless Indian feminism
Comment by Saraswathi — July 24, 2009 @ 2:36 pm
Sexual harassment at work place, schools, collages, parties, travel, roads etc. is a very common news which we hear the most. Most of the peoples are not aware about sexual harassment and its very important to make them aware, this will help us to decrease occurring sexual harassment. By the help of Pria’s (NGO) website we can came to know a lots of things base on sexual harassment. It’s my personal experience that this website help girls a lot and we can share our views and quarries with others in its forum.
Comment by Sexual Harassment At Work Place — February 12, 2010 @ 11:59 am